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Background

Atheist debate - Auckland University 7pm Oct. 2O.
 CALIFORNIA-BASED author, Ray Comfort offered to pay any Auckland atheist an honorarium of $100 to share his thoughts. "It's not easy to find atheists who are prepared to stand up for their faith (or lack of it). I was beginning to wonder if any did actually exist," Ray Comfort said. 

He diligently searched and found Mr. Bill Cooke, from the Dep. of Social Sciences, a Lecturer in Philosophy. He spoke for 30 minutes on "Why There is no God." Ray Comfort  spoke for 30 minutes on "Proof That God Exists." (He authored, 'How to Make an Atheist Backslide' (Bridge-Logos Publishers). 

 An incentive to attend, was made (a legitimate offer) of $US250,000 to "anyone who can offer any proof for the theory of evolution. The Association of Rationalists and Humanists (Inc) handed out pamphlets, so the next day I emailed them -

I woke up this Sunday morning looked outside and it was a beautiful day, sun shining, blue sky, but then a little voice said, 'NO IT'S NOT beautiful, it' s all in YOUR head!!'.. then I remembered I'd been to the debate last night between Ray Comfort and Bill Cooke [a grumbling lecture].  And I have been reading the yellow pamphlet from the Rationalist "Inc".

 Well I enjoyed the discussion but why did Cooke need to be so personal and even rude? After reading the yellow pamphlet it all makes sense. Rationalist and Humanists are not so much 'non-religious' as they are anti-Christian. Hence the question, why are Rationalist so anti-Christian? The pamphlet says humanists are 'advocates' of 'humane, opened minded, tolerant' concepts but those words are only a front to the real nature of Humanism  -  - to rid society ["protect"] of "any system of belief". What's wrong with belief? Like belief in tolerance and open-mindedness?  I'm amazed! I thought Rational and Humanists were decent folk with decent ideals but it's more anti-Christian than that.

 The more I read - the more it's true. Christians aspire to dignity for life. Humanists are for euthanasia...killing the old and sick? Man just becomes an animal to put-down? One might argue if that's humane or not. But Humanists are for abortion...killing human life in the womb. In fact, there are a whole lot of things Christians are opposed and for while humanists take the opposite. Why so anti-Christian? The 'heathen' address says it all - 'help remove Christians from NZ Inc'.  Well the debate was interesting - red-faced, nerves for some. Cooke must be a real character. I hope to go to the next debate - thanks very much.

Regards
Mark Purchase  Ph.D

Their email - Reply

A newspaper reveals how the debate went -

"Ray Comfort was quick of the mark to try to open his opponents mind to the fact of God’s existence. In reply to Mr Cooke’s question, ‘Who made God?’ he said that it doesn’t deserve a question mark. It is really a statement.

"However, the explanation is very simple. Does space have an end? If it does - if there is a brick wall at the end of space that reads ‘The End,’ I want to know what’s behind the brick wall," said Mr Comfort. "By faith you and I are forced to believe that no matter in which direction we set off, space will never end. It just goes on and on and on, forever." God also has no beginning and no end. "From everlasting to everlasting, You are God," Moses said. God dwells in eternity but time dwells in God. God has no past and no future. He has already lived all our tomorrows as He has lived all our yesterdays. "With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day" (2 Peter 3:8).

The glorious dawn of God’s story begins with the stunning yet profoundly simple statement "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" (Genesis 1:1). He was already there. He is eternal. God created time, but He doesn’t live within Himself. He’s not bound by or limited to it. He is greater than Creation!

God can flick through time as you and I flick through the pages of a history book. Eventually God will withdraw time, and we will then dwell in eternity.

The Atheist Test

The professing atheist is really an ‘agnostic’ - one who claims who ‘doesn’t know’ if God exists.
"I don’t believe in atheists," Mr Comfort said. "For Mr Cooke, who calls himself an atheist, to say categorically, ‘There is no God,’ is to make an absolute statement. For the statement to be true, I must know for certain that there is no God in the entire universe. However, no human being has all knowledge. Therefore, none of us is able to truthfully make this assertion. If you insist upon disbelief in God, what you must say is, ‘Having the limited knowledge I have at present, I believe that there is no God.’

"Bear in mind that one of the greatest scientists who ever lived, Thomas Edison, said, ‘We do not know a millionth of one per cent about anything.’

"If I were to make an absolute statement such as, "There is no gold in China, what is needed for that statement to be proven true? I need absolute or total knowledge. I need to have information that there is no gold in any rock, in any river, in the ground, in the bank, in any ring, or in any mouth (gold filling) in China. If there is one speck of gold in China, then my statement is false and I have no basis for it. Conversely, for me to say, ‘There is gold in China,’ I need to have seen a speck of gold in the country, and the statement is then true."

Without God

Is it possible for a mere human, less than a tiny speck on a pebble of a planet in the midst of a vast galaxy, to say that the great God who created everything doesn’t exist?
Do you know that nowhere the Bible sets out to prove that God exists? It just frankly states the obvious: "The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God" (Psalm 10:4).
It is interesting to note that the Latin equivalent for the Greek word is "ignoramus." The Bible tells us that this ignorance is "willful". It’s not that a person can’t find God, but that he won’t. In all his thoughts there is no room for God!

The word ‘atheist’ is made up of two Greek words: a - ‘without,’ and Theos - ‘God.’ By their own choice they are without God, and consequently without hope. Dwight Eisenhower said, "It takes no brains to be an atheist. Any stupid person can deny the existence of a supernatural power because man’s physical senses cannot detect it."

Seeing is believing

For Ray Comfort, the existence of God is what’s known as an ‘axiom,’ a self-evident truth. "The fact that parallel lines never meet is an axiom," he said. If I were to devote my life to trying to either prove or disprove that parallel lines never meet, I would lack common sense. It is so obvious it doesn’t need to be proved or disproved.

"The existence of God is an axiom. It is obvious that if there is a creation, there must be a Creator. For things to me ‘made,’ logic, reason, intellect, and rationalism demand that there be a Maker. This should neither need to be proved or disproved. "Let’s presume your problem is that ‘seeing is believing.’ If that is so, the next time you gaze at a blue sky, tell your eyes that they are not seeing correctly. The sky has no colour - ask any astronaut. It’s an illusion.

"Why do you believe a painting has a painter? Isn’t it purely because of the existence of the painter? Do you insist on seeing da Vinci before you believe that the Mona Lisa was painted? A reasonable argument could be that there may have been another painter, but never that there was no painter. "Do you insist on seeing the builder before you believe that the house you are in was built? Is that your criteria for belief? Again, the building is ample proof that there was a builder.

God exists

"The most brilliant minds on earth cannot begin to recreate an eye. If you lose one, the best modern science can do for you is give you a glorified marble to slip in the slot. Do you realise that each eye you are currently using at the moment has 40,000,000 nerve endings? If you have the brain-power to make one nerve-ending, tell modern science so that they can begin to see their way to making their first eye.
"The fact is, we can’t make anything from nothing. Find the most brilliant scientist on God’s earth, put him in a laboratory, and ask him to make something out of nothing. He can’t do it. He doesn’t know how. We can re-create, but we cannot create. We can’t even make one grain of sand from nothing. If that is the case, how could we even begin to think for a moment that all of creation, the human body, animals, flowers, birds, trees, fruits, the seasons, the sun, the moon, the stars, etc., fell together by mere random chance?"

Nothing on this earth that was ‘made’ has no maker. You cannot have a "creation" without a Creator. Ray Comfort said it like this: "I don’t need ‘faith’ to believe in a Creator, all I need is eyes that can see and a brain that works."

However, all this wasn’t enough for Mr Cooke to change his mind. He still doesn’t believe in the God of the Bible... "